Christian Stewardship and Investing

Shawn (00:00): If in your heart you don’t see the importance of the stewardship aspect of the biblically responsible investing side of it, your heart is not in it. Welcome back to Christian Financial Perspectives. My name’s Shawn Peters. This is Bob Barber, and today we have a very awesome topic that is both deep, but one that we feel is very important. Bob (00:32): We’re talking about Christian stewardship today and investing. Shawn (00:37): I know Bob in particular has spent a lot of time preparing for this episode and we are going to do our best to cover it in a way that number one, glorifies the Lord, and number two, that is done so in a way that is loving because sometimes the truth can be hard to hear, but we don’t want to be presenting this as well as us being prideful or as us trying to say like, “Oh, we’re holier than thou,” like a Pharisee kind of a thing. But it is something that’s important that we want to make sure that we get out there and that at the end of this episode, I would say whether you agree with us or not, that’s not really on us. That’s going to be something between you and the Holy Spirit. And we hope that this will bless you. Bob (01:27): Shawn, in developing this as sometimes the programs that come to me in 10 or 15 minutes, I think in this next 20 or 30 minutes you’re going to be listening to me. This took a lot of time, maybe 30 to 60 hours. I mean, because I was trying to say it in such a way that like you say, is loving, but in the same way, at the same time truth, truth can be dividing. I’m trying to lay the foundation here for you is first we got to talk about what is a steward. And as I looked at different definitions, I had one I came up with, it’s basically like a manager. So Shawn, I’ll let you read what is a steward, the definition I came up with. Shawn (02:12): So we’ll lay some of that framework and foundation for you here. So the definition of a steward, “A steward is responsible for managing anything entrusted to their care. This includes managing property, resources, finances, planning, organizing, staffing, leading, and making wise decisions.” So that’s a steward. But today we’re talking about Christian stewardship. Bob (02:34): Which adds another layer. Shawn (02:37): “Christian stewardship is the belief that everything we have, including our time, talents, and resources, is a gift from God to be used responsibly and for his glory rather than only for personal gain.” Bob (02:50): That’s the big thing right there. Shawn (02:52): Okay. Stewardship includes handling, finances, investments – are what we spend our time on, the gifts that we have, things that maybe you’re very talented or good at. That’s where that talent comes in, possessions and relationships. Bob (03:05): It’s looking at the manager and the steward from a biblical perspective. And then what goes into all this as the other part of the foundation is God’s ownership. The core principle behind Christian stewardship is the understanding that God owns everything, he owns it all and that we are managers, we’re stewards of his creation and all the resources. I mean this is everything. Shawn (03:34): Arguably that is the pillar because why Christian stewardship? Why talk about it? Why is it even a thing? Well, because starting with number one, God’s ownership. If God owns everything the earth is the Lord’s and everything in it, which is one of our scriptures we have today. Well, from that foundation then it’s a natural progression that, well of course we would be Christian stewards because none of it actually belongs to us. We’re simply managing and trying to do a good job with what God has entrusted to us. Bob (04:08): That’s hard for people to hear in America. “What do you mean this is not my stuff, this doesn’t belong to me?” He says in scripture it belongs to the Lord, it’s his. And like you say, we’re managers of it, but he gives us a lot of responsibility like an owner would in a restaurant or in a construction business or any business. The owner gives the manager a lot of responsibility and that manager is also held accountable Shawn (04:37): That’s right. Bob (04:37): So his responsibility and accountability and Christian stewards are responsible. We’re responsible for caring for and managing God’s gifts wisely and responsibly, knowing we will be accountable to how we use them, these things that God has given us to manage. Shawn (05:00): It makes me think, too, at Christian Financial Advisors®, I’m the operations director, so we’re not a 50 or 100 person firm right now. So, effectively whether you want to say operations director or chief operating officer or whatever you want to call it, at the end of the day there are certain things that Bob, you give me as responsibilities and I have some discretion. However, when it comes to what I’m doing, I always have to think, okay, well would Bob be okay with this? Is this something that aligns with Bob’s values and priorities as the owner of the business? And so that’s kind of the same idea of everything that God has entrusted to us. Well, he’s the big “O” owner. Bob (05:47): Because when you say that… Shawn (05:48): Because he actually owns it. Bob (05:49): Yeah, exactly. Because when you say that, that pressure on me comes to, wait a second, God owns this. And that’s why we want to operate Christian financial advisors from a biblical worldview because God owns it. Shawn (06:03): It does help me a lot that you are trying to align your stewardship of the business with what the Lord wants because then me aligning myself with what you’re trying to do, at least there’s not a conflict. If I was working for a boss who was not a believer, who wasn’t a Christian, that might be hard because there might be some times where, well, this is something that’s important to the person who owns this business even though God owns it all. But what about when there’s a conflict of, well, I know this is what the Lord would want me to do, but that’s not necessarily what the person I’m working for wants me to do. Bob (06:38): So I came up with, there’s four examples by the way. There’s a lot more examples of stewardship, but I came up with four main examples because this is going to go into what we’re talking today, which is about Christian stewardship and investing, but the first example is stewardship of finances, and that involves using our money wisely, giving generously, and investing with biblical principles. Shawn (07:02): That’s right. That’s right. And number two, stewardship of time. So prioritizing God’s work and using time effectively to serve others and advance his kingdom. Bob (07:12): Number three is the stewardship of talent, using our abilities and skills to serve God and to serve others. Shawn (07:20): That’s right. And then number four, stewardship of the environment. Caring for the earth and its resources, recognizing that we are responsible for protecting God’s creation. And when you look at these four primary areas, I guess you’d kind of say these are kind of covers most of it. Obviously, we could go into a lot more detail within each one of these, but when you’re looking at, well, when you’re wanting to be generous, when you want to do more for the Lord’s kingdom, that doesn’t always mean that if you don’t have a certain amount of dollars, you don’t have a certain amount of money, that you can’t be a good steward, that you can’t be generous because you have time, you have your talents, you have just, Hey, what are things you could do to help care for the earth and resources, not as a worship or elevating to almost idolatry the world. No, no, no. We’re doing a good job of this again, because the Lord made this. It belongs to him. Bob (08:18): Right. Shawn (08:19): I want to take good care of it. Bob (08:20): That’s why Christians should be should be… Shawn (08:22): We should the weirdest green nuts or environmentalists on the planet for whatever reason we’re not. Bob (08:27): It’s so funny because, and that’s something that we’re going to be talking about, which is biblically responsible investing is taking care of the environment. You don’t want to trash the environment because that’s what God made for us. Shawn (08:37): It’s out of respect for the creator and the one who owns it. Bob (08:41): And he made the creation for us. Shawn (08:43): I always think of it as if you’re house sitting for somebody, are you going to trash the place and put holes in the wall and maybe do some remodels for the way you, well, hold on. If you’re supposed to be housing, you’re supposed to make sure when they come back it looks at least as good as when they left. Not worse. Bob (09:04): Biblical basis for stewardship is found in many scriptures such as the command to work the land. Shawn (09:10): Genesis 2:15. Bob (09:12): And the Parable of the Talents, which we’ve had an entire program and you could go through our archives and look for that. We spoke strictly about the talents, I think Matthew… Shawn (09:21): Matthew 25:14-30. It’s a really good one. Again, that’s a fantastic example, too, of how with stewardship, not everyone is the same. We’re all entrusted with different things, whether it be different amounts of actual financial resources or talent or how much time we have on this earth. And so what it comes down to, though, is no matter how much or how little that you are entrusted with by the Lord, it’s do the best that you can to honor him. Bob (09:51): So here we get into Christian stewardship and investing. We’ve laid the foundation for it now and Christian stewardship and investing today is known as biblically responsible investing. Shawn (10:03): And some people call it faith-based investing. Bob (10:06): They do. Shawn (10:06): But we want to be specific. We mean the Bible. Bob (10:08): So this is just one form of Christian stewardship is how we invest those resources that God has given us. So there’s kind of a definition here of biblically responsible investing. I’ll let you go over that, Shawn. Shawn (10:23): So some examples include investing in companies that demonstrate Christian values while avoiding companies that support services or produce goods that violate them, regardless of how good the investment returns may or may not be with biblically responsible investing. Bob (10:38): As we’re going through this and we talk about the returns and biblically responsible investing, sometimes biblically responsible investing returns will be better, sometimes it will be worse. The main thing is this is not about the returns, this is about obedience. Shawn (10:52): Bob, we were talking a little bit in preparation for this, but there is a command for us to go and make disciples of all men. (11:00): But to do that, people have to come to faith in Christ first. They have to receive the Holy Spirit. We can’t really get into the real discipleship and learning more arguably advanced concepts. If someone hasn’t accepted Christ as their savior and has the Holy Spirit, they can’t really move on to that other stuff. They’re missing that first piece. Well really that’s when we say that the returns whether they’re better or worse. Okay, we certainly talked about that. We’ve talked about in other programs, but what it comes down to is if you’re watching this, if you’re listening to this, if in your heart you don’t see the importance of the stewardship aspect of the biblically responsible investing side of it, your heart is not in it. The rest of that conversation is kind a moot point because we’re not in agreement on that foundation and therefore whatever you do in any kind of comparison to secular versus biblically responsible, you’re kind of starting from a negative, I guess. Bob (11:59): You’re itching me to go, I want to get into this. So the biblical basis for biblically responsible investing and stewardship, believe it or not, it’s found in hundreds of scriptures, but we’re not gonna’ going to read all of them now. So we’ve already shared one with you, which is Psalms 24:1, “The Earth is the Lord’s and everything in it and all who live in it.” The second one is that kind of goes along with that Psalms 24:1 is Haggai 2:8, “‘The silver is mine and the gold is mine,’ declares the Lord Almighty.” He’s saying all the money is his because that was used as the monetary exchange back then. Shawn (12:35): And then we have James 4:17. Bob (12:37): Which goes under BRI again. Shawn (12:38): That’s right. “If anyone then knows the good they ought to do and doesn’t do it, it is a sin for them.” And 2 Corinthians 6:17, “‘Therefore come out from them and be separate,’ says the Lord, ‘Touch no unclean thing and I will receive you.’” Bob (12:52): So this is the basis for biblically responsible investing. It really is calling for separation from the way the world does it. This is God’s ways, not man’s ways. Okay. Christian stewardship and investment returns. Another great scripture I think is very important when we talk about that investment returns is Ecclesiastes 5:10 says, “Whoever loves money never has enough.” That’s the main thing there. “Whoever loves wealth is never satisfied with their income, As this too is meaningless.” You see Christians stewards need to be extremely careful of investment returns becoming an idol. So we’re going into a different part here. We we’ve talked about stewardship and investing and now we’re talking about investment returns because I’ve seen in my years of doing this, Shawn, in America, investment returns become a form of an idol to somebody. When I looked up the definition of idolatry, it’s the worship of anything that’s made by human hands and minds, which is many times behind investment returns. Shawn (13:55): Yeah. Well, and Bob, as you’ve seen in over three decades of working with clients, I mean you’ve had clients that have been with you for over 30 years. Bob (14:04): Yes. Shawn (14:05): And many, many that have been with you for 20 and somewhere more or less than that, but you’ve had a lot of longterm relationships. Bob (14:13): I’d say average about 25 years. Yeah. It’s been a long time. Shawn (14:15): And correct me if I’m wrong here, but have you not noticed that the actual potential investment returns are almost never really that important? Because what it comes down to is that planning and making sure that you’re saving and investing enough and that chasing the returns, not only is it not going to make you wealthy, but it also isn’t really the most important thing for that planning for that long term, and therefore being a good steward. Bob (14:43): Yeah. We’ve mentioned that we’ve had programs that investment returns is not what is behind the majority of wealth. Shawn (14:50): That’s right. Bob (14:51): It’s not about investment returns, but if we obsess over those investment returns or lack thereof, and we start becoming fearful again, it’s becoming an idol. 2 Timothy 1:7 tells us, “For God has not given us a spirit of fear, but of power and of love and of a sound mind.” And we should not fear ever. When markets are down, it’s interesting when the markets are way down, the phone’s not ringing off the hook here, but I remember talking to Matthew when he was with another major secular firm. He said, man, Haywood gets so many calls and people would be so mad because we know who owns it and we’re not putting the investment returns as an idol in putting this above God because Exodus 23, which is the first commandment, “You shall have no other gods before me.’ So we’re not going to make investment returns our god. Shawn (15:52): That’s right. God cares much more about how we invest and what’s in our hearts, the why, than the returns we make on this earth, whether good, bad or average. Because remember, God owns it all. So what does it matter to the Lord if you made a little bit more here or a little bit less here or somewhere in between because he already owns it all anyway. How do you have more than 100%? Bob (16:18): Now, this is going to be an interesting one, too, as we’re talking about stewardship investing, you realize investments should be viewed as tools for stewarding God’s resources, not as objects of worship. Shawn (16:30): That’s right. 1 Timothy 6:10, “For the love of money is a root of all kinds of evil. Some people eager from money have wandered from the faith and pierce themselves with many griefs.” Bob (16:41): I don’t mean to be adding or taking away from scripture when I say this, but in this passage, if you took the love of money and just replaced it with the love of investment returns because investment returns can create more money. Shawn (16:54): It’s still the same. It’s helpful for the concept. Bob (16:56): It’s meaning it’s the same, it’s the same meaning. The question, and the question always is, how much is enough If you make 7% over 6% or how about 8% over 6%? At what point do we as Christians ever sell out our Christian values for possibly a better return if it’s even available? And not that it’s going to be that with biblically responsible investing, but remember some years, sometimes two years or three years, it may be better with secular investing and doing it God’s ways and then the next three years it may be better with biblically responsible investing because as you know, biblically responsible investing focuses more on the midsize companies versus the mega caps because the mega caps get so woke on us that it’s very hard for us to invest a lot in the mega caps and when the market is relying on three or four companies to push it up that don’t fit our scenario. Shawn (17:51): And also that one year versus the other, it comes down to investment philosophy as well. Because you’re looking for companies that, keep in mind, we say biblically responsible investing. For those who haven’t seen some of our other programs, that doesn’t mean we’re only investing in Hobby Lobby and Chick-fil-A, like openly Christian companies. Bob (18:09): Which those two aren’t even public, so we couldn’t. Shawn (18:10): Exactly. Yeah. But it’s more so of, well, no, these are companies that simply are aligning with biblical principles and values. They’re not violating those things. They’re treating people well. They’re producing good products. And so just think about it logically. Okay, well those companies that do that are also going to be far less likely to get into trouble from chasing stuff just for the sake of greed or trying to abuse people or vendors. And so it just depends on the year which one did better or worse. Bob (18:41): We’re getting kind of to the end. I had a couple more scriptures in here. There’s so many. Hebrews 13:5 warns us to, “Keep our lives free from the love of money and be content with what you have because God has said, ‘Never will I leave you. Never will I forsake you.’” Again, you can replace that love of money with the love of returns. It’s basically the same thing. Shawn (19:01): That’s right. And Matthew 6:19-21. I won’t read the whole thing, but it reminds us about where to store our treasure and why. And specifically in verse 21, it states, “For where your treasure is there your heart will be also.” Bob (19:12): As we come to the conclusion in obsessing over investment returns actually reflects a materialistic worldview that aligns with the world’s priorities, not god’s. Shawn (19:25): That’s right. Matthew 6:24 warns, “No one can serve two masters. You cannot serve both God and money.” Pursuing wealth above all else leads us to neglect God’s kingdom and justice. Bob (19:37): This next little saying, I’m going to say I’ve got it from a friend of mine that’s really strong, very deep into the biblically responsible investing movement. He said, “The pursuit of better and better returns over proper stewardship of God’s resources can cause us to forget that the internal value of our lives is not found in wealth, but in the kingdom of God.” Matthew 6:19-21 teaches that we should store up treasures in heaven, not on earth where they’re temporary. Christian stewardship and biblically responsible investing are very different from the world’s ways. It’s a clear choice here. God’s ways or man’s ways. So I hope this has helped you today. We’ve gone into quite a journey. It took a little bit longer than normal, but remember, biblically responsible investing is just another way of aligning your faith and your life with the biblical worldview. And if you’re interested in learning more, Shawn, give them all our contact information. Shawn (20:38): Sure thing. You can call our text us at 830-609-6986. You can also visit our website, www.ChristianFinancialAdvisors.com, and some other areas of Christian stewardship we’ll be covering the future, Christian stewardship and financial planning, Christian stewardship and possessions, Christian stewardship and estate planning, Christian stewardship and giving, Christian stewardship and spending, Christian stewardship and financial advice, and Christian stewardship and saving. As always, thank you so much for joining us. If you stuck around this long, go ahead and give us a like or drop us a comment on if you have a preference for another topic you’d love to hear us cover. And yeah, hope you join us for the next one. God bless. [DISCLOSURES] * Investment advisory services offered through Christian Investment Advisors Inc dba Christian Financial Advisors®, a registered investment advisor registered with the SEC. Registration as an investment advisor does not imply a certain level of skill or training. Comments from today’s show are for informational purposes only and not to be considered investment advice or recommendations to buy or sell any company that may have been mentioned or discussed. The opinions expressed are solely those of the hosts, Bob Barber and Shawn Peters, and their guests. Bob and Shawn do not provide tax advice and encourage you to seek guidance from a tax professional. While Christian Financial Advisors® believes the information to be accurate and reliable, we do not claim or have responsibility for its completeness, accuracy, or reliability.